The problem of miracles
Posted by Matt W. on February 12th, 2007Gospel Doctrine for next week has the following purpose attached to it:
To help class members understand some of the reasons the Savior performed miracles
In the spirit of the leadership development broadcast over the weekend, I thought it would be appropriate to go over my thought process in preparing this weeks lesson for my class.
To begin with, I teach an eclectic group of 16-17 year olds who have various special needs, and my lessons in the past have been hits or misses, depending on the week.
Anyway, here is a rough outline based on thinking about it last night and again this morning. Where would you add? Where would you subtract? What would you want the Youth to take away from the lesson that will change their lives forever and create more miracles in the world?
What is a Miracle?
- traditionally, miracles are viewed as supernatural events
- the LDS church has a different view. “Miracles are commonly regarded as occurrences in opposition to the laws of nature. Such a conception is plainly erroneous, for the laws of nature are inviolable. However, as human understanding of these laws is at best but imperfect, events strictly in accordance with natural law may appear contrary thereto. The entire constitution of nature is founded on system and order; the laws of nature, however, are graded as are the laws of man. The operation of a higher law in any particular case does not destroy the actuality of an inferior one.” James E. Talamge
- A typical LDS definition of a miracle is: “An extraordinary event caused by the power of God” (Guide to the Scriptures, Miracle)
What Miracles did Jesus Perform?
- Power over Death
- Power over Nature
- Cures
- Exorcisms
- “Supernatural” knowledge
- Virgin Birth
- The Atonement (Power over Sin)
Why did he perform these miracles?
- To show love and compassion (see Mark 5:19; see also 3 Nephi 17:6–7).
- To build and confirm faith (see Matthew 9:27–30).
- To prove his divinity and power (see Mark 1:27; 2:10–11). (see also Matt. 11: 4-5; John 2: 11; John 10: 25; John 20: 30-31).
- To teach an object lesson about such divine truths as the result of sin and the cure of sin; the value of faith; the curse of impurity; and the law of love. (The fig tree.)
What other types of miracles are there?
Are their other purposes of miracles?
- To help us overcome problems in our lives or the lives of others
- To tell us things
- To help us align our wills with God
Do Miracles happen today?
Can miracles happen in your life?
- Yes.
What are the requirements to cause miracles to happen?
- Faith
- Must comply with God’s Will
- Must be requested via use of our agency (Hel. 10:4-7)
Do miracles come by Prayer?
Some Argue No:
The Logical Problem of Prayers:
1. A perfectly good God won’t make the world worse than it is if he can avoid it and will always make it better if he can
2. An omniscient and omnipotent being can do anything not logically impossible
3. It is never logically necessary for an omniscient and omnipotent being to make the world worse; it is never logically impossible for an omniscient and omnipotent being to make the world better (this is a false statement, so what follows is false.)
4. an omniscient, omnipotent, and perfectly good being never makes the world worse and always makes the world better. From (1,2,3)
5. A petitionary prayer requests a state of affairs either making the world worse or better (or neutrally indifferent.)
6. If it makes it worse then the omniscient, omnipotent and perfectly good being would not fulfill the request. From (4)
7. If it makes it better then the omniscient, omnipotent and perfectly good being would already do it regardless of the prayer. From (4)
8. Therefore prayer accomplishes nothing. From (1-7)
9. Therefore prayer is pointless.
The LDS “Solution to the Problem of Prayer.”:
As soon as we learn the true relationship in which we stand toward God (namely, God is our Father, and we are his children), then at once prayer becomes natural and instinctive on our part (Matt. 7: 7-11). Many of the so-called difficulties about prayer arise from forgetting this relationship. Prayer is the act by which the will of the Father and the will of the child are brought into correspondence with each other. The object of prayer is not to change the will of God, but to secure for ourselves and for others blessings that God is already willing to grant, but that are made conditional on our asking for them. Blessings require some work or effort on our part before we can obtain them. Prayer is a form of work, and is an appointed means for obtaining the highest of all blessings. (Bible Dictionary, Prayer)
Miracles are an interesting subject, it will probably go well.
There was a book once, still is I guess, entitled Faith Procedes the miracle. This is good to keep in mind as well. Usually a miracle blesses the lives that show faith. Not the other way around. It usually is not those who experience miracles develop faith.
I also consider conversion a miracle.
Comment # 1 left by Eric Nielson on February 12th, 2007
While I agree that the virgin birth was a miracle, I am not sure I would put it in the category of miracles Jesus performed.
Comment # 2 left by Michelle on February 12th, 2007
A perfectly good God won’t make the world worse than it is if he can avoid it and will always make it better if he can
Hmmm. Can’t we run into the challenge of trying to understand God’s point of view of what is “making the world worse/better”? I worry about imposing mortal definitions on God. Making the world better/worse is not His ultimate purpose, IMO (at least not in the phase of mortality)…it’s making US better. That means conditions in the world are sometimes allowed to be worse than we want them to be, and sometimes won’t be made better on a large or small/personal scale because of purposes we cannot understand. (Gets back to Pres. Kimball’s “Tragedy or Destiny” lesson, IMO.)
Comment # 3 left by Michelle on February 12th, 2007
I would like to nominate Michelle’s comment on the virgin birth for the BoJ Hall of Fame.
Administrators!, Make it so.
That is all.
Comment # 4 left by some guy on February 12th, 2007
You know the problem with miracles? If you rush a miracle, you get rotten miracles.
Comment # 5 left by Eric Nielson on February 12th, 2007
Thanks all for your comments.
Michelle, I think it is a general tenant of Mormonism that we can know God’s will for us via prayer. While I agree that President Kimball’s Tragedy or Destiny is an excellent source (And I suggest reading the full original in “Faith Procedes the miracle.”)
In a stupid nutshell, people suppose that if God knows everything, then he knows what we will ask for before we even ask for it in prayer, so we don’t need to ask for it.
I think you are correct, in part, that what God wants is to make us better, and he wants to teach us how to have faith and rely on him so that we can be better through our relationship with him.
I hypothesize, that, as no unworthy thing can enter the presence of God, He can not come to us without “destroying” us, fundamentally. So we need Christ to bridge the gap and make God accessible to us, and make us accessible to God. (I’m not locked in on this, but it is my current theory of the way things are.)
Comment # 6 left by Matt W. on February 12th, 2007
Matt,
I agree with you. I wonder if we may be talking past each other a bit, although I can’t put my finger on where or how. I completely agree that we shouldn’t take the route that because God knows everything, we shouldnt’ ask for anything.
I’d be interested in hearing more about your hypothesis…maybe you could chew on that in another post.
Comment # 7 left by Michelle on February 13th, 2007
No worries, Michelle, I dodn’t think we’re talking past each other, I think we are talking WITH each other, and for that I am grateful.
I’ve posted my “hypothesis” here and here a while back, but I may elaborate on it in the future.
Comment # 8 left by Matt W. on February 13th, 2007
Wait a minute….I have been thinking of Michelles comment where she said:
This is interesting. If we believe that the conception of Jesus was a spiritual, non-physical, non-sexual thing, then why could Jesus not have been the source of such a miracle? I don’t believe this in the least but it might make for an interesting question.
It is important that we believe that Jesus is the Son of God. That he was the first born in the spirit and only begotten in the flesh. To me there are a few reasons why Jesus can not be considered the source behind the virgin birth.
Comment # 9 left by Eric Nielson on February 13th, 2007
Eric, you’re not gonna go off on the “vivaporous” thing all over my post are you
Seriously, the VB probably belongs on a list more like “Miracles associated with the mortal Jesus”, if we wanted to break it down as such.
Comment # 10 left by Matt W. on February 13th, 2007
I think we are talking WITH each other, and for that I am grateful.
Good, then. I won’t worry so much.
why could Jesus not have been the source of such a miracle
“and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee” — that sounds like God the Father’s power was what was involved. There are a few miracles in history that weren’t delegated, and I think this was one of them.
Comment # 11 left by Michelle on February 13th, 2007
p.s. that was Luke 1:35
p.s.s. Does this mean you won’t let my comment go to the Hall of Fame, Eric?
:) 
Comment # 12 left by Michelle on February 13th, 2007
I think it should go there. I also think you belong on a HofF somewhere.
AAAAAHHHH.
I’m just not sure which one!
Comment # 13 left by Eric Nielson on February 13th, 2007
Eric, have you read this post.
Comment # 14 left by Matt W. on February 13th, 2007
Sheesh. How does one make a smily face with the eyes rolling?
Comment # 15 left by Eric Nielson on February 13th, 2007
What is this, bash Eric day? Matt brought up two of my previous posts to use them against me! In one thread!
Comment # 16 left by Eric Nielson on February 13th, 2007
Oooh, a *Princess Bride* quotation!
So I think the most important thing I’ve ever learned about the miracles Jesus performed in the NT is that they are less important in and of themselves than the healing of the soul they synecdochally represent. Of course, I still want the big ol’ physical miracles. But it still helps me to realize the BIG miracle is the atonement. I wish I’d realized that when I was 15, rather than assuming God shows his love by handing out physical goodies like a celestial pez dispenser.
Comment # 17 left by Janet on February 14th, 2007
synecdochally? I think that if you knew, and spelled, and used that word properly then a type of miracle has occurred.
Comment # 18 left by Eric Nielson on February 15th, 2007
Janet: I do believe that you are correct, that the value of God’s miracles is important in relation to what they synecdochically represent. But there are seemingly outliers, like the parrable/miracle of the Fig Tree, which does not point, at least, directly, to the atonement.
A challenge I personally have with the miracles is discerning at what level of literalism I should take them on.
Eric: Sorry for picking on you, sincerely.
Comment # 19 left by Matt W. on February 15th, 2007
What a word! The wikipedia has this.
No worries Matt! It is actually kind of flattering that you remembered previous posts of mine and used them.
Comment # 20 left by Eric Nielson on February 15th, 2007
Eric–I did have to look up the spelling. Spelling has not been encoded in my DNA, and practice doesn’t seem to help the situation. I’m going to assume it’s somehow charming (convenient, eh?). Also, I’m an FMH-er, and y’all know we can’t spell :).
Matt–yeah, literalism = problematic territory and the fig tree presents plenty o’ confusion. I like your post a lot, though, and dearly wish all teachers who instruct youth took their jobs so seriously. I think a lot of teens really do care. I did. When I finally got a teacher who took his calling as seriously as you seem to take yours I was ecstatic. I can honestly say he played an instrumental role in teaching me to love scripture study. So kudos to you!!!
Comment # 21 left by Janet on February 18th, 2007